Finding Balance: A Path to Mindful Drinking with Alice Ferris
Welcome to Journey to the Sunnyside, the podcast where we have thoughtful conversations to explore the science of habits, uncover the secrets to mindful living, and, of course, inspire your own mindful drinking journey. This podcast is brought to you by Sunnyside, the number 1 alcohol moderation platform. Platform. And if you could benefit from drinking a bit less, head on over to sunnyside.co to get a free 15 day trial. I'm your host, Mike Hardenbrook, published author, neuroscience enthusiast, and habit change expert.
Speaker 1:Today, we're joined with Alice Farris, who shares her mindful drinking journey, what's been the key to her success, and how the Sunnyside app has been instrumental in setting up goals and tracking her progress. We'll talk about the improvements she's had in her sleep and overall well-being, highlighting the roles of planning, accountability, and support from her circle of friends. Alice's story is a testament to the power of mindful drinking, offering practical steps for anyone looking to improve their relationship with alcohol.
Speaker 2:Okay. Today, I'm here with Alice Ferris. And, Alice, thanks for coming on today.
Speaker 3:Hey. My pleasure. Thanks for the invitation.
Speaker 2:It's great to have you. Why don't we just get started with a little introduction? You can tell us a little bit about where you're from, what you're up to now, and maybe a little bit about what you're passionate about these days.
Speaker 3:So I'm based in Flagstaff, Arizona, which unlike the rest of Arizona, which people assume is all desert and cactus, is actually at 7, 000 feet. So we do get winter. We do get snow. So I'm appreciating the fact right now that we actually don't have snow on the ground yet because, at the time of this recording, it's the end of December, and I'm grateful for having good weather. And I am a fundraising consultant.
Speaker 3:So I own a company called Goalbusters, and we work with what we like to say small and mighty nonprofit organizations who are trying to do good things in the world but don't necessarily have the resources or have the systems to be able to do it. So I'll be honest that I love my work. I absolutely love my work. So that's kind of 1 of the things that I'm really passionate about, and helping nonprofit organizations kind of find that that formula to be able to make fundraising work for them is is 1 of the things I'm really excited about.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's amazing. I mean, there's probably so many things that we could chat about on the side here because I come from a background. I did Americorps, and I worked in the nonprofit for a while, building houses with Habitat for Humanity for a couple of years. We built a couple hundred houses. And I'm also from Arizona, so I know exactly what you're talking about as far as that goes.
Speaker 2:Well, you're here on the the podcast with, Sunnyside, and so I think it makes perfect sense to talk a little bit about that. And let's just talk about tell us about your mindful drinking journey.
Speaker 3:1 of the things about myself and drinking is that we kind of have this running gag in my family because I'm of Asian American descent. My family's Taiwanese. And, there was 1 time that my parents my dad and my sister and I went to a wine tasting, and I was just tasting all the wines and trying all these different things. And I think my dad had the first sip of the first taste and immediately got flushed. And and at 1 point, he joked with me.
Speaker 3:He says, why are you the only 1 in the family who can drink? And I joked back, well, practice. So I've I've been 1 of those people that has enjoyed a beverage or 2, and especially given my profession being in fundraising, as much as we don't like to admit it, you know, alcohol is part of that social lubricant that you need in the fundraising process or that we think that we need in the fundraising process. And while I have definitely had fundraising things that I did where there it wasn't a happy hour or wasn't a dinner that involved wine. It is part of the culture of of the fundraising professional sector.
Speaker 3:And so, like, when I go to conferences, when I go to other events where I'm around a lot of other fundraisers, we do tend to have a drink or 2. And I do enjoy it, but 1 of the things that I have noticed over the years is, first of all, I think we're becoming more conscious in the sector of the, hey. Maybe that's not as healthy as we would like it to be. But, also, I'll be completely honest. I'm a 50 something perimenopausal woman.
Speaker 3:And over time, I have discovered that things that I used to do all the time and not see the physical impacts of are now showing the physical impacts. So I started thinking about the what can I do to change my lifestyle habits in addition to other things that I'm doing to try to minimize my perimenopausal symptoms, to maybe deal with some of the weight gain I've been dealing with? And, the idea of being more intentional about my drinking definitely was 1 of those things that came to play.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's a great story, and I I totally can identify that. And I've talked to so many people that have these industries that they're in where it's just it's accepted, and it's not really frowned upon and maybe even expected. You know, I come from marketing and sales background. A lot of sales dogs like to put them back. And then also the tech startup world where it's trendy to put a beer on tap that's okay to have, pretty much while you're at work.
Speaker 2:So, you know, I think that a lot of those outside factors drive us to maybe be in places that we wouldn't normally be if we were in in other sectors or just not surrounded by, that. I wouldn't say peer pressure, but just accessibility and acceptedness of it. So I think that's a great story. Was there anything 1 particular instance where you just kinda said to yourself, you know, I'm not really happy, with with my current habits, so I I think I'm gonna change. Was there any 1 instance, or was it a little ongoing and you're just like, I don't know, you know, for comparison's sake, sometimes you just say, hey.
Speaker 2:I need to eat better. And that there's not like 1 sitting in front of, like, where you ate a whole cake and said, okay. That's it. You know? Was there any 1, or was it just kinda gradual?
Speaker 3:I I think it was a gradual slope for me because I don't think there was, like, that moment where I woke up thinking, oh my god. I cannot drink like that anymore. Because, well, when I'm at conferences or at some kind of industry type events, I do tend to drink more. And even now on my mindful journey, I still drink more when I'm around other fundraisers. But, I I still didn't for the most part, I would say, yes.
Speaker 3:There are those occasions where it's like, oh gosh. I shouldn't have done that. But for the most part, I knew what I was doing. And and even when I had those days where it was like, oh, gosh. I shouldn't have done that, I kinda knew what I was doing, so I gotta take ownership of that.
Speaker 3:And but over time, it was the, hey. You know? First of all, I'm not seeing a bet back to the my health is being impacted more than it used to. And and while I enjoy it, I am definitely seeing the impacts of it over time. And so that's part of it.
Speaker 3:But but then the other thing was is I think part of it was my son getting to an age where he was, you know, at drinking, quote, unquote, drinking age. And 1 of the philosophies I had in teaching him about alcohol was I didn't wanna make it this thing that was forbidden that he would then say, okay. As soon as I'm of age, I'm gonna go binge drink or something. And so we tried to demystify it in the house of the this is just another food. This is just another ingredient.
Speaker 3:This is just another drink that you can try. And what I ended up doing as he teases me is I turned my son into a wine snob because I would only have, like, the good stuff around. And you can't just, like, slam I mean, you can. But you, in general, don't slam back the good stuff. Right?
Speaker 3:It is the you think about it. You savor it. And I found myself being more mindful about my own drinking as my son was learning about alcohol as well. And so I think the combination of me reaching an age where alcohol was making an impact on my health and my son reaching an age when he could, in a socially acceptable environment, drink, I think those 2 things combined together came to my journey of the, let's think about this a little bit more.
Speaker 2:That's a great lesson to to teach your kids. It sounds like, you know, you you educated yourself into this mindful journey, and you wanna pass that that experience on so that your son can can do that. And I also think it's really interesting as far as demystifying it. You know, in American culture, it's very forbidden up to a certain age. And then it's just basically, well, you're 21 now, so go ahead.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I think also, you know, it depends on the family. A lot of families are open like that under under the legal age in that way because whether or not they were are saying to themselves, well, I was 18 once, and it didn't affect me to be able to do that. Or it's that I don't wanna pull this back from them so that when when it is allowed, they just go out the gates and there could be problems. And you see that in, like, European culture where it is demystified.
Speaker 2:It is about what that would look like specifically. But I think anecdotally, that makes sense that, you know, there's just a little bit more of a mindful relationship when it comes to that. So tell me about you mentioned that when you would go to some of these conferences still to this day that maybe you might have have more than you typically would. But in this current, journey that you're on, would you say that are there some things that are changed when you do go that do that? Are you giving it more thought?
Speaker 2:Are you maybe the next day giving yourself more grace because you know you're being mindful or, you know, maybe paint a little bit of a picture for me?
Speaker 3:I think a really good example of of how my drinking has been impacted by my current mindful journey about drinking is in October of 2023, my business partner and I were on a 3 week European tour. And we visited 4 countries in 3 weeks, and 3 out of those 4 countries were work related. And and so there were some functions we would have to go to. There was a conference that we went to, and there was 1 day where I did drink more than I was planning to. And as soon as I hit, you know, the number that I was, quote, unquote budgeting for that day, and I knew, okay.
Speaker 3:I'm gonna have more than this. The thing that was different is that I made a conscious decision at that point of the look. I'm at this point in the evening. It is the last night of this part of the journey, and I know I'm going to drink more than I was planning. And I didn't beat myself up about it.
Speaker 3:I said, you know, look. Did I slow it down? Yes. I actually did slow it down. Or but if you ask 1 of my friends that was with me, he probably would say, no.
Speaker 3:You I don't think you slowed down. But in my mind in my mind, I was like, look. Here's what I'm budgeting. And, actually, I hit the budget for that amount after that decision point in the evening. And then the next day, I was like, okay.
Speaker 3:Do I feel great? No. Actually, I don't feel all that great. Do I feel, like, completely destroyed? No.
Speaker 3:I don't feel completely destroyed. And am I gonna take it a little easy today? Absolutely. And so giving myself the grace to look at the entire week and say, okay. Yeah.
Speaker 3:You kind of overindulged that day, but you can see how this is gonna balance out over 7 days. And and being a little bit more conscious for the next couple of days of the well, you know, okay. Let's pump the brakes a little bit. And and not beating myself up about having a bad night, but also not feeling this, extremism of okay. Now you have to be completely sober for 5 days to make up for that.
Speaker 3:I didn't do that. I was frankly, that portion of the trip, I was on vacation. So so it was the okay. Give yourself a little bit of grace. And I think that's the thing I've appreciated about this dry ish or this, you know, more mindful journey of drinking is that I have been 1 of those people that in the past has done the extremes.
Speaker 3:You know? I am going to attempt, for instance, the whole 30 where you're gonna throw everything out basically for 30 days, and you're not gonna eat anything that you normally eat, and I inevitably fail. And the thing I appreciate about a more moderate approach to this is I do have the ability to give myself a little grace. And and so I do have a higher level of success because I don't feel like it's an either or yes or no kind of decision.
Speaker 2:Yes. I love that. I was actually going to move into that topic based off some of what you were just saying, but you made it easy and said a lot of what I was gonna ask. And I think that it the dryish January is so important because not only, like you said, you give grace and move forward, but it also it has the other effect that if, let's say, you get to week 2 and, you know, you have something to drink, then people have the tendency to just well, you know, it was all or nothing. I might as well throw it out the window.
Speaker 2:2025, I guess, is gonna be next. You know? And so it it it's this shift that you need to think that we're not all gonna be perfect.
Speaker 1:I think if we were gonna look at diet, you know, hey. I try
Speaker 2:to eat low carbohydrate for health reasons. And if I go out with the family and I have piece of pizza, I'm not gonna beat myself up. I'm not gonna say, hey. I don't eat low carb any longer. And I think that when people can separate themselves, from the alcohol and look at it in that those same sort of terms that I think that you like you just said, you get more successes.
Speaker 2:And, you know, if somebody were to ask you, I asked you about what your mindful journey. If somebody was to ask you, like, what is mindful drinking, how would you define that, or how would you explain it to them?
Speaker 3:I think I'm gonna go back a couple years to the beginning of the pandemic, and other people, you know, picked up sourdough as their their pandemic hobby, and I picked up cocktails.
Speaker 2:And You and a lot of people.
Speaker 3:Yes. Exactly. Although 1 of the things that I realized when I was, like, playing around with different cocktails is that it really wasn't about volume. Even though at this point, you know, we were all locked down, we could drink as much as we want, frankly, and not have to worry about, you know, being out driving or something. But what I've discovered during that process was I liked the ritual.
Speaker 3:I liked the here's my transition between being in front of a Zoom Zoom screen for work and being done for the day. And so I liked the bringing the bar tools out and having the clear ice and having all of the different accessories. And then when I tried the dryish January for the first time, I realized that with the nonalcoholic cocktails, I was kinda getting the same results. I was still getting the process and the ritual of making the drink, and it just didn't have alcohol in it. And I discovered that that was almost as satisfying make again because it primarily because a lot of them are really sweet, and that is just doesn't match my palate.
Speaker 3:But the the process, the the mindfulness in making the drink and choosing the ingredients and all of this stuff. So even now, if I pop up a bottle of wine to have a glass of something, it is really about the okay. I've always had, you know, the the fancy corkscrews and and the decanters if I need them and all of those different things. But I'm also thinking more consciously about what wine I'm selecting, what wine I'm buying, and and reading the label and learning about the producers and that sort of thing. So I think mindful drinking for me is the not only thinking consciously about when I'm going to drink and how much I'm going to drink and what functions are going to trigger my drinking and being aware of that ahead of time, but it's also about the the process and and being conscious of the here's what I'm gonna do, and here's the the ritual I'm gonna go through and and what that impacts me how that impacts me.
Speaker 2:Yes. For sure. I mean, pretty much what you're explaining is habit swapping 1 for another. And I've I also heard somebody say, don't change the ritual ritual. Change the ingredients.
Speaker 2:And it sounds like that is something you did there. I can identify because for me, it always when I was drinking wine in the evening, it always marked that the end of the day as an entrepreneur, which there's no cutoff. Right? And so the only it's self imposed, which could go and I in many times would go well into the night, start in the morning, and that's just burnout is inevitable. And I never kept alcohol or wine or beer in my fridge or on the shelf be not because I was afraid of it being there, but because I enjoyed stopping, going to the store, and picking out the bottle of wine that I was gonna have that evening.
Speaker 2:It's it's still something that I like to do. Instead, though, I'll use that ritual to go find some other thing that I you know, I want something fizzy or I want something sweet or something like that, and I think it really does hit the spot. Or even sometimes if I'm not having anything but my wife wants some wine, there's some satisfaction, and I'll go out and buy the bottle of wine for her, and I actually don't drink it. I'll call her. You know?
Speaker 2:Sometimes I'm at this for, hey. Are you sure you don't want that bottle of wine? Because, I don't mind buying it. Like, is That's great. That sounds weird.
Speaker 2:But
Speaker 3:No. It's awesome.
Speaker 2:So I I'm curious to know. How did you end up finding Sunnyside? I'm always here interested to hear, like, what what made you be drawn to him, or where do you see it?
Speaker 3:1 of the things that I really dislike about Instagram is how good their ads are. So my social media of choice nowadays is Instagram, and I think part of it is as well, first, I've kind of abandoned, you know, the social media, formally known as Twitter, just because of the toxicity of it. And and Facebook is something where I've kinda backed off on as well, but Instagram is my place where I just kinda scroll through pretty pictures, and and I like that. And very often, I get ads on Instagram that are very, very well curated for me. And there was an Instagram ad for Sunnyside, and I said, dryish January?
Speaker 3:What the heck is that? And the piece that I really liked about it is that ish part because I had, of course, heard about dry January. I knew other people who had done it. I know people who, went sober for several months, and mostly it was related to weight loss or health related concerns for them. And I always said, you know, I should try that.
Speaker 3:And then I would last a few days, and then I would have some social event where I was supposed to be there. And the x cultural expectation of that event was you have a glass of wine or you have a cocktail or fill in the blank. And and some of that was self imposed. You know? I said, oh, well, every time I go to this particular event, I have a glass of wine or I have a glass of more more often than not, a a Manhattan.
Speaker 3:And so may a lot of that, I think, is completely self imposed on my part. But the dry ish part was what got my attention because it's like, wait a minute. I can choose the days that I potentially want to drink and plan ahead for this. I like this idea because then I can have the number of dry day dry days that I have budgeted and and feel like I accomplished something that week. Because I'm totally that person.
Speaker 3:I've done this in presentations before where I ask people to raise their hands and say, okay. Are you the type of person who, if you do something in a given day and it's not on your list, you add it to your list so you can check it off? Because that's totally me. Yeah. And so the idea of doing something where I couldn't just check it off every day just really bothered me.
Speaker 3:And I knew that if I went totally dry, that I wouldn't be able to check it off every day. It it just would not be realistic for me. And so the dry ish part was what attracted me to Sunnyside was the flexibility to say, okay. You're gonna have 3 dry days this week or 4 dry days this week or even 5 dry days this week. But these other days, you're gonna you're gonna plan on having a glass or 2.
Speaker 3:And and there's, you know, there's no fault in that.
Speaker 2:No. Not at all. And I we talked a little bit about this before, but I think also not only does the the hard commitment of going the 30 days set a lot of people up for failure because there's always gonna be those social events like you said, but But I also think it keeps people from committing because they already know they're probably gonna fail. Mhmm. Where it sounds like when you came in, it was like, okay.
Speaker 2:This is actually something that's realistic. It will improve, and align with my goals right now. And so I I loved hearing that because it it gives the other side of it, the entry point of it. And so once you started you download the app. You you signed up.
Speaker 2:What were what were the features or what were the parts about the Sunnyside app that really you felt like this is this is great. This is helping me out or or that you used the most.
Speaker 3:I use the flexible planning feature all the time. And in fact, I continued using Sunnyside after the dryish January, and I've used it pretty much this entire year because I like the fact that it sends me a little reminder on Sunday. Hey. It's time to plan your week. And then I can look at the week and realize, okay.
Speaker 3:I know I have a social function this day, so I'm gonna budget 1 or 2 glasses of wine. Or more often than not, I know I am gonna make a steak for dinner that night, and I need to have a glass of red wine with that steak because that is a total I like that. I like the taste and the combination. So I am going to budget for red wine on that date because I'm making steak. So it allows me that flexibility to say, okay.
Speaker 3:This week, like, when I was in Greece for a week, there is no dry day. This it is just the way it is. And and then there's another week that might be the total opposite where there's going to be 6 dry days this week or even 7 dry days this week. And I like the fact that each week can be customized. That's my favorite feature.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. And I and it sounds like it just gives you that mindfulness. It sounds like because you're you're okay with, look. I'm gonna be in Greece. I might drink too much ouzo on every single day, but that's okay.
Speaker 2:You know? Because all these other days, I'm planning for it's all planned. I already have it. So give me
Speaker 1:a little give me 1 story if
Speaker 2:you can think about it, where either you were at a social event or went to somebody's house for a gathering and you either the it's a dry day or you have a set limit, is there an instance you can think of where maybe you would have failed before, but this time you succeeded?
Speaker 3:That's a good question. I think probably a good example of a day where I was at a social function, and I knew, okay, I could completely go off the rails. I I and not to the point of being socially incomprehensible, but it's the I'm planning to have 2 drinks at this event, 2 glasses of wine, and it could easily go into 3, 4, or 5 over the course of a, you know, just say 3 hour event. You know, I know consciously and intellectually that 1, 2 max glasses of wine is what I should be doing as a woman of my height and weight and of my age. But there is that social pressure of the just keep topping off that glass.
Speaker 3:Right?
Speaker 2:Of course.
Speaker 3:And this was 1 of those social functions where I knew that someone would be coming around, and they would just be kinda topping off glasses of wine as as they went. And because I had budgeted, okay, you're going to have 2 glasses of wine at this event, I actually sipped. And so I I made it so that my glass was very seldom at a point where someone would feel like they needed to top it off. And what I realized was that nobody noticed because I always seem to have a glass a full glass of wine in my hand, and no 1 was keeping track of how many times I brought that wine glass to my lips. And if as as I was mingling, because I was 1 of the hosts of this event, I could go from group to group to group, and they wouldn't know how much I had consumed at the previous group.
Speaker 3:And this was it was great because by the end of the night, I actually did hit my 2 drink goal over a over a 3 hour event where I was the host and felt really good about it. And it's like, no. You actually did what you said you were gonna do, and you committed to it. And I think that with the help of using Sunnyside to budget, it it helped put some boundaries on me that I wouldn't necessarily have had otherwise.
Speaker 2:Yes. You definitely had a win, it sounds like. And, you still had a good time. And even though, you know, maybe those people didn't notice, it's so funny how we always think that people are gonna notice. Yeah.
Speaker 2:You know? And and that people care. But, but you know, what that did for you is that made you feel comfortable and at ease. And and that's what it's all about. It's just feeling comfortable with having having your limit and enjoying yourself and coming back, and the very next day, you know, not feeling bad about it about it.
Speaker 2:You it's definitely a cumulative effect of winning over and over again. Let me ask you
Speaker 3:And I think go. Let me add 1 more thing. I think particularly with that event and to your point about the we don't we sometimes think people are paying more attention to us than we are than they are. I think what I was doing back to the kind of habit stacking and habit replacing is the there was a social trigger. Right?
Speaker 3:There's a social trigger of you're at a social event, and you are supposed to be drinking. And instead, I've kinda replaced the trigger with, hey. I get a little message on my phone from from Sunnyside saying, remember, you've budgeted 2 drinks today. And so that's almost my new social trigger of the, oh, wait. My Sunnyside coach said that I'm only doing 2 drinks today as opposed to the social trigger of the, I need to have 4 glasses of wine.
Speaker 3:And so I think that's been really helpful.
Speaker 2:No. It's great. I mean, not only the trigger, but it's also the accountability there, you know, and and that's science has proven that accountability definitely helps us reach our goals. And do you think that are you seeing people in your social circles that are starting to be interested in changing their relationship and maybe in a mindful drinking manner. Is that something that you've heard or talked to anybody about?
Speaker 3:I don't know that I've talked very consciously about it with people, but it definitely has come up on occasion. And part of it is, frankly, my age group where all of us are kind of reaching this point where the things that we used to do with abandon don't have the same, you know, laissez faire impacts on our lives and our bodies. So some of it is just the the vanity, frankly, of of getting older and wanting to make sure that we look fit and healthy moving into the rest of our life. And so some of it has just been the, oh, well, jeez. I need to cut back on alcohol because I'm gaining weight, and I need to stop doing that.
Speaker 3:So there's that piece of it. But I think for me, it's back to my son and and having more of those conversations about about alcohol and and really appreciating it as as a food product as opposed to, hey. You know, there's that forbidden thing. Because do I still have alcohol in the house? Absolutely.
Speaker 3:Do I have higher end stuff than I used to have? Yeah. Actually, I do. And and it's because I am spending a little bit more money because I have, first of all, the ability to do that. But spending it on stuff that I want to savor and I want to enjoy in a in a slightly more intellectual way as opposed to, hey.
Speaker 3:I really want fill in the blank alcohol right now. It is more the, oh, let's enjoy that the ritual of the wine. Let's enjoy that ritual of the cocktail. Let me try this new, you know, PD collaboration with, like, 6 different providers. I mean, there are really a lot of different niche things that that you can get, and I'm just curious about those things.
Speaker 3:So, I think in terms of talking to people about the mindfulness journey, in many respects, it aligns with some of the trends about minimalism because there's this thing in minimalism about minimalist luxury. And I kinda feel like I'm getting there with with alcohol, and my mindful journey with alcohol is that in many respects, it's moving more towards this minimalist luxury drinking lifestyle too, where when I drink, it's gonna be something that is really good that I'm really interested in.
Speaker 2:No. I like that. As you were talking, it made me think of, like, a French restaurant or something that brings out this plate. And then the portion's small, but it's super rich and delicious and full of flavor, and it kinda there's a parallel there, I think, between what you were saying. If you had to have 1 thing, is there 1 benefit along this journey that is marked in your mind as being you know, I really like how that how those things have come about through time, whether it's through health, whether it's through clarity or sleep.
Speaker 2:Is there 1 thing that you just kinda feel like, yes, this is definitely an upgrade from where I was before?
Speaker 3:Mhmm. I have noticed as I've been drinking less that my sleep has improved substantially, and I am totally that person who has all of the apps and toys. And I have this app called Rise Science where I can actually track my sleep debt over time.
Speaker 2:I have seen that 1.
Speaker 3:Yep. And and my sleep debt, when I don't drink, on days when I've had a dry day, my sleep debt the next day inevitably goes down. And it may be just a quarter of an hour, but it will go down the the next day. And then I notice because it will show me my sleep patterns. If I have 1 glass or 1 cocktail of some sort, it's usually not impacted too much.
Speaker 3:But once I get beyond that 1, then I can definitely see the changes in my sleep pattern. And just seeing that immediate data feedback and connecting it with the amount that I was drinking was the, oh, wow. Maybe to prioritize sleep, you should be merging it with this idea of mindful drinking. And it's not that I entered into the mindful journey to impact my sleep. But when I saw the impacts on my sleep, it became reinforcing for for this journey.
Speaker 3:So I do feel a lot more rested having having been more mindful about when and how I drink.
Speaker 2:Yeah. There's definite the science behind it is and the anecdotal. My own experience is it it it's for sure a huge difference in quality of sleep and, yeah, you can track it as well. And and even there are studies that pretty much indicate that after 2 drinks, every drink thereafter, you reduce the quality of your sleep about 20%, and so you really can affect your sleep by quite a bit, and I know that I felt that. And in fact, if you're drinking too often too much, then you really can't even it it's worse the day after than than the day of you drink.
Speaker 2:So it actually takes almost 2 days sometimes for people to recover. And I think that's the 1 thing that I a pattern I hear with almost everyone is that, yeah, my sleep is so much better, or I don't wake up at 3 AM, you know, out of nowhere because I'd whine the night be that night. And so I think that's sleep is so important. So that's gonna impact everything in your life. And and so when you when you you may not have noticed it before, but then when it improves, you definitely say, woah.
Speaker 2:It's way better than it was.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. If there is 1 piece of advice, you know, for somebody that you knew and said, hey. You know, like, I don't have I really just wanna change, you know, this year in 2024. Is there anything that you would just say that really worked for you? Obviously, you use Sunnyside app, and I'm not looking for just a plug.
Speaker 2:But is there something, you know, in your in your mind where you could say, hey. This is how you need to reframe your thinking, and this is the approach maybe you could go after.
Speaker 3:I think 1 of the pieces of advice that I would give someone on the mindful journey about drinking, but just in goal setting in general, is I've typically been someone who, when I have a big goal, I share it with somebody. And there I know there are a lot of people who don't wanna share goals. Like, for instance, I used to be the chair of a a fundraising credentialing board, and it is 1 of those credentials that's hard to get. And very often, people would keep it private. I don't want anyone to know because I'm afraid I'm gonna fail.
Speaker 3:And what I typically would advise people is that, hey. You know? If you feel that way, then you may be setting yourself up to fail because you're already anticipating failure. And so what I like to encourage people to do for all the goals, big or small, is, you know, tell somebody about it because then they can help you stay accountable to that. I think, for instance, Sunnyside is part of that tool for me in that, yeah, it's an app.
Speaker 3:Could I lie to it? Yeah. I totally could lie to my Sunnyside app, but there's something in my head that won't allow me to do that. And if I told other people that, hey. I'm trying to drink less, then they're like, oh, okay.
Speaker 3:Cool. I'm always surprised that when I share goals that I think, oh my gosh. I can't possibly share that, and you share it with someone. Either they're really excited about it or they're just they're like, yeah. That's whatever.
Speaker 3:Great. Do what you need to do. And I like the fact that it gives me that social network, that social support. So it's almost like a social safety net so that if I tell people, hey. It's January.
Speaker 3:I'm trying to do this dryish January thing. I'm gonna try drinking less. And they're like, oh, great. Well, then why don't we just go out for coffee instead of going out for happy hour? It's like, awesome.
Speaker 3:So it's always interesting to me that people think that most people are gonna try to destroy their goals. But for the vast majority of people, not everyone, but for the vast majority of people, the network you have around you wants you to succeed. And so they can help you succeed if you tell them what you're trying to do.
Speaker 2:Yes. Definitely. And that support can rise you up. And if you're in a network that isn't gonna lift you up, it's a good idea to try and find 1 that would. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, I think that this has been amazing. Thank you so much for taking the time to come on. You shared very helpful and insightful information, and I love your story, and I love seeing the progress that you've made. Maybe there is some, nonprofit people that are listening to this where it would make sense for them to reach out, or maybe they just have some questions. And, you know, remember that Alice is so honest that she wouldn't even lie to an app.
Speaker 2:So, you know, she you can trust her. Is there a place where maybe people could reach out to you?
Speaker 3:Sure. Our website is goalbusters.net, And then you can also find me on most of the socials at alicebarris.
Speaker 2:Great. Well, we'll link them up for you. And thanks again, Alice, for taking the time.
Speaker 3:Thank you.
Speaker 1:This podcast is brought to you by Sunnyside, the number 1 alcohol moderation platform, having helped 100 of 1000 of people cut out more than 13, 000, 000 drinks since 2020. And in fact, an independent study showed that Sunnyside reduced alcohol consumption by an average of 30% in 90 days. And as 1 of our members shared, Sunnyside helps me stay mindful of my drinking habits. It's not super restrictive. So if I'm craving a glass of wine with dinner, I just track it and I move on with my week.
Speaker 1:If you could benefit from drinking a bit less and being more mindful of when and how much you drink, head on over to sunnyside.co to get a free 15 day trial. You'll get access to everything that we offer, including tracking and planning tools, coaching from our experts, a vibrant community of people just like you, and the motivation and advice to stay on track with your health goals, all with no pressure to quit. That's sunnyside.co.
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